El Al’s final 747 flight from Tel Aviv to North America will depart as El Al Flight 1 on Thursday, October 25 at 12:30am from Tel Aviv to JFK. The final North America 747 flight will return from JFK to Tel Aviv at 10:30am on the same day.
El Al will still operate 747s to Bangkok, though the El Al 747 fleet is on the way out.
747s around the world are being phased out in favor newer and more efficient airplanes. El Al’s 747-400s haven’t had a refresh in many years and have had their share of maintenance issues, but the Queen of the Skies is still a beautiful sight to see:
The first 787 will fly from JFK to Tel Aviv on 7/1. The final 777 between JFK and Tel Aviv will be on 9/13. After that point El Al will operate 2 daily 787s and a daily 747 until 10/25.
After 10/25, El Al will only operate 2 daily 787 flights for the winter season between JFK and Tel Aviv. That is the fewest number of seats between JFK and Tel Aviv in years and may serve to drive prices higher.
The 2 daily 787-9s between JFK and Tel Aviv will have a total capacity of 64 business class seats and 500 premium economy and economy seats.
This winter El Al is currently operating a 747 and a 777 between JFK and Tel Aviv. Those have a total capacity of 14 first class seats, 85 business class seats, and 586 economy seats.
El Al is shifting some of that capacity over to Newark where they will start operating 2 daily year-round 787-9 flights starting on 3/25 in order to do battle with United, whom El Al sees as their biggest competitor in the North America-Israel market. The 787s have a new premium economy class, but the business class has mixed reviews and there is no first class on El Al’s 787s.
El Al still plans on operating their older 767s to Boston and Toronto and their 777s with first class to Los Angeles and Miami.
El Al’s 787 strategy has been an interesting one. Most airlines have used the plane on longer routes that have less demand, but El Al will be moving their flagship NYC-Tel Aviv route to all 787s effective 10/26/18.
What do you make of El Al’s 787 strategy?
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53 Comments On "El Al Announces Final 747 Flight Between North America And Tel Aviv; End Of First Class And Major Capacity Cut For JFK-Tel Aviv Flights"
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I don’t think that I’ve ever been on an empty 747 flight from JFK to TLV. On the contrary, most flights are full to the max. I’m not sure why they’d lower capacity on such a high profit route. There is also a limit to how many people would pay such a high premium processing for such a mediocre airline
I guess they want to test what the limit is.
The sad thing is that the economy class on the 787 is quite tight. Not something you would make a premium for over Delta’s A330 or United’s 772.
Average customer just sees “new plane” or “Dreamliner” and doesn’t appreciate the decrease in personal space (and sometimes doesn’t even realize it once on board and impressed by the “sleek new look”).
As noted, elal added capacity from Newark so I wonder if United will add another flight.
The seats in Economy do NOT have to be “tight” — When the 787 first came out, I flew one with Azerbaijan Airlines — and the flight was VERY comfortable. If El Al wants to “drive business” to other airlines — let them continue to try to “squeeze” people…
I was actually once on an empty 747 plane was full about to 200 passengers.
elal capacity cut in jfk could make an opportunity for american to launch jfk tlv
American likely can’t fly to TLV due to legacy TWA issues.
Delta tried a 2nd JFK-TLV flight, but that failed.
Most likely capacity increase would be United moving to 2 daily 77Ws, but that would be from EWR.
i doubt its TWA issues i heard it just cost 20 mil to settle, that’s pennies for them, i personally know alot of ppl that fly united on all their domestic flights due to them having tlv flight. if american launches it can cause additional revenue for them since those customers they get may switch all their flying to them.
Can’t they once & for all settle this?
Isn’t the Israeli ministry of tourism interested in getting more flights from the USA?
Isn’t A”A interested in getting in on a high demand route?
(Probably Elal won’t want them to settle, & they will fight any settlement, but everything has it’s limits)
What @Mike said is so true, i try to fly United on all my flights because I have elite status with them from my flights to Israel.
@Dan maybe make a full write up about this?
I third that
I recall that when TWA “pulled out” — there were accusations of anti-Semitic on the part of TWA… American COULD have settled this long ago… I think that they REALLY do not care…
$20MM is not pennies.
I don’t see any other reason they pulled out of TLV.
@dan its not the twa 20 mil,ill explain to you why,
my theory is the following american had a relationship with elal prior to merger with us. once us air took over the idea was that by cutting off the partnership with elal that may push traffic to there own flight hereby making it profitable but that didn’t work so then cut the route.
the only way elal can compete in us market is to partner with a us carrier with full mileage benefits,
the best choice is to partner with aa on the frequent flyer end and full codeshare. by doing that they can successfully compete with united and delta. since elal flies into aa hubs (lax,mia,jfk,bos, sfo not hub) by american having acsess to elal network they can win many more corporate contracts and elal can then get alot of traffic taken from united and then would be able to compete in usa. its a win win for both
what you think dan?
The PHL-TLV flight ended as soon as the merger cleared. They didn’t wait to see if additional feed would help.
I can’t see any other reason for the cancellation other than TWA issues. The timing of the cancellation adds up as well.
MIA-TLV or JFK-TLV on AA would otherwise have made sense as well.
@dan Merger happened on dec 2013 flight stopped Jan 2016, don’t understand how it was as soon as it cleared
It was still a USAirways flight until 10/16/15.
AA announced they were ending the route on 08/20/15.
They were also caught lying about the route’s profitability:
https://www.dansdeals.com/points-travel/airlines/aa/american-is-pulling-out-of-tel-aviv-010416-grab-award-seats-now-for-reaccommodation/
I flew with a american flight from phl after they changed to us the boarding passes and uniforms said american although I bought a US ticket
It was American from October 2015-January 2016. They had already announced the end of the route by that point.
what means TWA issues
Does not make any sense to me. First class to Miami but not to NYC?
Reducing the capacity probably more reasonable. Since 787 are cheaper in maintenance and more fuel efficient it might cover $ lose in capacity and if the price goes up it will get even better.
Additionally, it might signal about upcoming ORD/WAS route since big chunk of the NYC traffic goes to those cities .
@ PM
Miami, South and Central America passenger’s are willing to pay $ for first class seats. Agreed, United will announce ORD-TLV flights.
El Al doesn’t look at it as a capacity cut. They’re just dividing their flights between JFK and Newark more evenly for the winter. In the summer season season I’m sure they will be adding an additional daily flight to JFK. In fact, the total capacity between TLV and the NYC area next winter will be higher than this winter. IMO, the title is misleading.
I said it’s a JFK-TLV cut, not an NYC-TLV cut.
Still misleading. Especially for thousands of people who get the tweet and don’t bother reading the article.
This is an article about the JFK-TLV route, not NYC-TLV.
I noted the 2nd EWR flight coming online in March, but the focus is on the big reduction on JFK-TLV and the end of First class on the route.
So what’s the total capacity this year compared to what it will be next year? NYC – TLV.
824 seats in economy and E+ becomes 1000 seats in economy and PE.
139 business/first becomes 128 business/first
Dan, the head photo of the article could be a 747, doesn’t have to be a 787.
Unfortunately this means longer flight times, as the 747 is faster. Well, unless it stops in Canada along the way. Now, if only they would open up more aeard space.
Dan, can you please advise the best option to book a group trip in October 2018 (NYC to TLV) ? Approx 20 in humanitarian group ….
I flew Delta in April 2017 and it was pricey …
Thanks
WOW is your friend
Group tickets are something you should call each airline’s group desk and negotiate.
About 9% of American Jews live in New York – most of them might prefer to fly from JFK, although if landing fees and other costs there drive fares up they might choose Newark. About 6% of American Jews live in New Jersey. Some near Philadelphia might prefer a connecting flight to JFK, but most would choose Newark. About 3% are in Connecticut: Would they prefer JFK, or Boston? It seems to me that for every three flights originating at JFK, there should be two from Newark considering only local boardings.
But the issue is where the other 82% of the country would prefer to connect. Take out the 6% who live in California and Florida, and might prefer Los Angeles or Miami, and that still leaves 74%. Newark is a hub for United (which, of course, competes on the Tel Aviv route). Delta and American have frequent service there also. Some websites report that immigration lines are shorter at Newark, for arriving passengers. So let’s split those passengers evenly, remembering you don’t have to be Jewish to fly El Al. That means Newark should have 43% of the traffic, and JFK 46%. And it looks like that is the airline’s objective.
@bob united has a hub in ewr to bring connecting traffic to their tlv flights elal has no partners in ewr so i dont understand any connecting traffic coming to their ewr flights mostly o&d
Exactly. Connecting feed to EWR is almost all taking the United flight.
AA has very little EWR feed for El Al.
This is a big reduction for JFK flyers.
Assuming connecting passengers have no greater loyalty to El Al than to United, that’s true. A certain minority of connecting passengers might make a choice based on mileage plans. Most would probably favor United; some would favor El Al. What if I have enough miles to get me to the East Coast on United, but not across the Atlantic and Mediterranean? I’ll connect in Newark.
Number of people using miles to get to EWR on United to pickup an expensive El Al nonstop flight is probably close to nil.
@ Dan
Perfect opportunity for United to launch ORD TLV route.
It is all about the seat. Both El Al and United squeeze the passengers on the 787 into tiny seats. The difference is the biz seats: United’s 6 abreast on the 787 is a pretty backward product, whereas El Al’s new 4 abreast with direct aisle access for each seat in the 787 is much more comfortable. The opposite is true for the 777: El Al’s angled “wedgie seats” on the 777-200 are miserable. United’s true Polaris seats on the 777-300 (currently operating between EWR and TLV on some, but not all flights) are great.
My wife and I live in Israel. We recently flew into JFK and out of Miami. Both flights were half empty. We bought the cheap seats and the entire back of the plane was laying flat due to everyone having a row to themselves. Also in Miami they offered to check any extra baggage free at the front check in desk (perhaps for weight as the flight was so empty?).
I hope DL makes a second run for an additional JFK flights. With the amount of Christian groups flocking to Israel, they can use the JFK feeder system from the south. Last few DL flights to TLV I took were full with about 75% not Jewish at all.
We live in LA. We fly United from SFO to TLV Polaris class. Nice seats. Kosher food ok, not great but we fly for comfort not food. Cheaper than EL AL. Nicer flight. Now I hear EL AL is starting a flight in October from SFO.
Dan: please let people know that new 787-9 are nothing but for the airline, to save money on fuel. The economy seats are terrible.
“The final 777 between JFK and Tel Aviv will be on 9/13”
Correct. However the 777 will be flying between TLV and EWR between Sep 14 and Oct 26 every Friday on the midnight flight LY27 and return MS LY26.
but nish oif shabbos geredt
Friday midnight, means arriving Friday early morning – not traveling on Shabbos….
It’s time to say goodbye to these planes.
I traveled a few times last few months the are old and shabby almost nothing works correctly, the seats are unbearable.
They were a very fleet when they were new.
Its time to move on.
From ElAl’s perspective, wouldn’t it make sense to retrofit some 777 and have a 3-4-3 econ config, new J and PE classes, and updated IFE? Then deploy 787 on the less dense LAX/BOS/MIA/YYZ flights.
I was at Everett/Paine Field yesterday spotting (way cool!!), EDD just came off the line yesterday and is awaiting first flight, with C just opposite it and one stall down. Tail and stripe painted but no titles yet.
I do t have a camera, only my Nexus 6p but if you zoom in on the photo in the link you’ll see them….
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4rht3wp6o7p152j/IMG_20180129_100322.jpg?dl=0
there was an article that Arika was starting to fly to Thailand this summer, maybe they will also start to fly to NY.
Supposedly the have some 330s coming to them……
Dan, whats your take?
EL AL could have replaced their current 747-400s with the 747-8, as Lufthansa and Korea Air have.
I fly to Israel monthly in business, sometimes 2-3 times a month. For ten years. Always EL AL.
Not after October’s last Queen of the Skies flight. I am moving my business to United.
EL AL should never have switched from the 747 to the “plastic plan” … the 787.